Dune Network Community Partnership Proposal

[mrbateman31]

Thank you for the additional questions all.

@denis55petro , I hope I am translating correctly! The roadmap was due to be updated in late December to account for several new developments (such as OASIS), however, this is when the concept of the merger first came about.

@encipher, the 16 month lock will apply to ORL team tokens. The rest will be used to swap community held tokens over a period of time. Converse to other proposals, we bring a community of avid crypto enthusiasts who will be assessing the long term potential of TON and holding accordingly. In this way, we foresee no situation where this merger results negatively on the TON ecosystem.

@Cogscides, a good point. Liquidity is a cruel mistress, and with over 70% of DUN currently staking, out charts for these kinds of things are all over the place admittedly. The spike you circle is the result of a trading competition and promotion which took place upon listing on CoinTiger exchange. It’s also worth noting we have a significant unofficial OTC telegram market, and figures can be requested from those running this group easily. And in terms of tokenomics, DunScan: the Dune Block Explorer by OCamlPro everything you could ever want or need to know is available at a click.

@Aleksandr, a little harsh, but to try to respond. We are an indy project at heart, very much like Free TON, we held no ICO and private investor funds raised were minimal. I’m not sure I understand why well known investors wouldn’t consider this swap in the same way as any other investor, if you could elaborate on this? I would have to disagree about the dapps. On playground, for example, the games themselves may be simplistic, but the underlying mechanics are anything but! Check out this article for an in-depth explanation of Dune Raffle. (Fully Decentralized Raffle Game On Dune Network | by iguerNL | Dune Network | Medium) Not sure which glass our community will be putting their swapped coins into sorry, perhaps an expression I’m not familiar with? The merger brings a whole host of benefits to Free TON, listed in the proposal – experienced community members, network activity, PR, potential new experienced validators, presence within The Garage, and not forgetting the very specific expertise that ORL themselves bring (formal verification being something which Free TON could benefit from exponentially as I understand it). And in terms of doing it on a pro bono basis, could you again explain further what you mean? To reiterate what I said above in the previous response, the team and community will not be getting free tokens. It will be a swap of their existing DUN, for TON Crystal. In essence, Free TON would cannibalise the market cap of Dune token by token. It is a balanced equation which merges together the two separate entities, to, as I say in the proposal, become more than the sum of our parts.

I hope this answers all of your comments and queries, please let me know if I have missed any!

[elk]

Всё так красиво расписано, но выглядит как будто нам хотят впарить свой неудачный проект за 9 миллионов кристаллов. Описанные бенефиты от слияния очень сомнительны, всё это либо уже есть во фритоне, либо в этом нет необходимости.
Я решительно против слияния, как было упомянуто ораторами сумма сразу же полетит в стакан

Everything is so beautifully painted, but it looks like he wants to sell us his unsuccessful project for 9m crystals. The described benefits of merging are approaching zero, also they are either already in the Freeton, or their impact is very dubious.
I am strongly against the merger, as was mentioned by the speakers, the amount will immediately fly to the exchanges

[Soressu]

9 bln dogecoin norm?

[laugan]

Everything is so beautifully painted, but it looks like he wants to sell us his unsuccessful project for 9m crystals.

I think that’s true. Still, we’re not buying project itself, we’re buying commmunity, devs, media and tools. I’m not sure that they’re so unsuccessful too.

The described benefits of merging are approaching zero

Do you have some proofs or details of your point? This proposal lacks some proper public due diligence more than others. I’m not entirely convinced in tech benefits, but I see some PR/community benefits.

the amount will immediately fly to the exchanges

That’s possible, Dune community is not excited about this too.

An access to all the exchanges where Dune is traded

All 3 exchanges? I think for such amount of TONs proposal should be more specific.

Also, I think it will be good to receive proofs of intentions from:

16 current Ambassadors across 6 countries;

Tiers 1 supporter of Dune Network : Xavier Niel, Tinder CEO, Zenly CEO, Voodoo CEO and many more, etc;

Do they really want to stay in case of a merge? Perhaps we should lock not only Origin Labs funds but all key teams, investors and ambassadors from this proposal? Then, those persons who will explicitly reject locks cannot be considered benefits that we’re paying for.

P.S. Despite all obvious risks and high price, I think I’m not against the merge. We spent 400 million TONs and we still have only 30,000 accounts. With merging Dune we will have another 30,000 accs of real people (judging by media activity) for 9 million TONs. That’s not cheap, but we’ll also double our media coverage with new media channels and investors. I’m not sure about dev teams and technologies. I think someone should evaluate them in terms of usability for our ecosystem. For now, the entire story is about PR and involvement of new people. That’s risky and pricey, but we spent money on far worse partnerships, IMO.

[Crypto_Communism]

У одного меня такое чувство, что нас как сообщество жизнь ничему не учит?

[mrbateman31]

@elk , Can I make clear that I am just a humble community manager, the voice of the proposal. To be frank, I stand to gain very little personally from this merger.

@laugan thank you for your assessment. Indeed, the reception to the proposal on our side has been less enthusiast than I might have hoped. Both projects have gaps in them at present, and, as I see it, would be able to benefit one another exponentially. Crypto can be a very profit driven environment, and both communities seem to be wary of the motives of the other. This is something which would need to be addressed should this go forward in order for the maximum benefit to be achieved. We are hosting an AMA session with the Dune community later, and while it will be aimed at our community primarily, if anyone would like to attend from Free TON’s community they are more than welcome. It could help for our community to see the passion of Free TON in order to enthuse them more to seeing the value of the project.

[rururu]

I’ve only been a member of the TON community for the past 1.5 weeks, but I get the sense that I’ve joined a startup that’s spending somebody else’s money.

The changes that I believe need to happen in order for this project to gain acceptance in the worldwide community is to put your TON where you mouth is. Lets lock up staking, let lock up free tons that are given away for mergers, proposals, etc. 12-24-36 months. I don’t believe that TON should be used as “salary” or “earned fees” that will then be exchanged for BTC/fiat on the open exchange.

Don’t we want to develop an ecosystem to which people will be drawn to; instead, I am beginning to feel that TON is being solicited like a cheap prostitute - to get off quick - … instead, I would prefer to build a community and go after the girl that no one can get - this is what will drive user engagement and value.

I am looking forward to continued engagement with the leaders of this community.

What has been discussed? Locking up staking - yes. Vesting schedules - yes.

I, too, am not against growth, but smart decisions must be made and not just hope. If we want to merge or do a deal with someone, lets get someone from our community to join their community and get the view from the inside.

[bakarapara]

9 million TON’s for this? Never heard about this project though im almost full time in crypto more than 3 years.

this proposal sounds like one more bad joke to me.

[igowreck]

По сообщениям выше видно что партнество не стоит запрошенных монет, я не поддерживаю его.

[jouliene]

If we merge, then we get about 2000 users. Considering that Free TON has about 12’000 unique users now (I count by a number of Surf accounts) than receiving 2’000 new users would be 16% increase in userbase of Free TON. And this is GOOD.

I do not consider it is necessary to evaluate DUNE’s technological platform somehow. They join us, not we join to them.

I propose to treat the merger simply:

DUNE has 2000 users, and they want 9’000’000 TONS, i.e. 1 user for 4’500 TON. Which is a HUGE amount. Plus we need additional tokens “for development of the merger”. So the actual price of 1 user to be more than 4’500 TONs.

We need to ask ourselves what is reasonable price which we are ready “to pay” for user?

For example, if community give you …. let’s say 1’000 TON per user would you be able to bring 5-10 new users? I think the answer is: EASY. If 400 validators invite 5 of their friends/relatives and give them per 1’000 TONs then we easily receive 2000 new users in community. And it would cost us only 2’000’000 TONs. And since it looks EASY I consider even 1’000 TON per user is too expensive.

So, I think that we can accept this merger for 1’000’000 TONs. (i.e. 500 TON per user). Otherwise, it is too expensive and dilute the value of TON coin.

[depool.live]

поддержу с условиями:
9 миллионов с вестингом на 2 года
желательно токен DUNE перевести по технологии tip3 на отдельный workchain

I will support with terms and conditions:
9 million with a 2-year vesting period
Preferably transfer the DUNE token via tip3 to a separate workchain

[laugan]

@depool.live

I will support with terms and conditions:
9 million with a 2-year vesting period

But 9 mlns are not for Origin Labs team, they’re for swapping accounts of usual Dune users to TON tokens. I’m sure it will be unfair to lock their funds.

I vote only for locking money of Origin Labs and of described “benefits” like ambassadors and alike.

[TheCrabbyPaddy]

Hi, I would like to come and say that I was one of the main escrows in dune. I have done more than $500,000 usd in terms of volume for Dune.

More than happy to provide some proofs of some OTC trades. Many community members chose to use OTC rather than the exchange due to time / fees / usa residents etc.

There is a lot more volume than shown on explorers

[bakarapara]

We are talking about open market which shows interest to the project. Daily volume less than 1k is clearly shows that project is almost dead, and there is absolutely no interest from users/investors to what they do. No matter if there was or wasnt any OTC deals in the past. And this market interest clealry isnt correlating with 9kk TON’s requested for this proposal. Thats all i wanted to say.

[KateMama]

Maybe we should implement merge whithout partnership? First, through contests, we need to create a bridge between Free TON and Dune networks. Too early for a partnership in my opinion.

[velikorodov]

Очередной распил . Спасибо

[mrbateman31]

Hi all, rather than do all the talking myself, I’ve posted a recap of the recent Dune Community AMA with Fabrice LeFessant, Cyril Paglino, and Ron Millow, which should address many of the points raised.

January 2021 Community AMA Recap

[Magic-Game]

Hello, I am an active member of the Dune community (ambassador and baker).
I have read the comments and would like to add my point of view.
Dune network is born from a folk of tezos, with a team which contributed to the notoriety of tezos (OcamlPro). Well-known investors around the world helped launch Dune. The project is not known by everyone in the crypto world but it has been able to develop in a short time (about 18 months) with a very competent team and an active community.
When the team introduced us to the project to merge with Ton (in December 2020), many did not know Ton (me too).
Members were afraid of this merger because TON was unknown to them … And as you know, the majority of the members do not look at the details but only the titles.
Imagine if tomorrow someone tells you that Ton is going to stop to merge with another blockchain that you don’t know, imagine the wind of panic!
This is what caused the price of Dune to drop and also the volume because people are now in a waiting position …
They await the vote of the 2 respective communities.
So the reaction of our community is logical.
But the price of Ton has also fallen a lot and I think that the ratio proposed for the merger remains very favorable in favor of TON, which of course does not satisfy all the members of Dune.
What is the opinion of the majority of our members?
Believe me that the majority of active members of the Dune-Network community will follow the team in this merger because we know the value of our team, they will be able to bring great added value to Ton with high level applications.
The 2 communities will gain in a few months because projects planned for Dune can be quickly brought to TON: Oasis, Love-language etc …
Also our active members will continue to be active at Ton; already many Dune members have registered in your various Telegram channels.
In my humble opinion, with this merger our 2 communities have a lot to gain in the future

[xambrella]

To be honest, after this interview I have more arguments against than I had before. To me it sounds like this: we failed, join us, but you have to pay for it.

You are proud that you are a small and distinctive indie project, but at the same time you regret not being able to become a giant. Very controversial.

The only reason for me to vote for that is to increase the diversity in the community. Increasing the number of decision-making poles. But there are also problems with this, since Cyril has a great influence in both communities, combining all this again into one pole.

New users? Doubtful. Since the announcement of this partnership, there has been practically no activity on the part of Dune here in that topic, which is strange. You wish to merge with us, but only a few people considered it necessary to express their opinion here. It doesn’t smell like any special enthusiasm.

[mrbateman31]

I believe, as @Magic-Game mentions above, there has been a sense of trepidation regarding the proposal on the side of the Dune community. The timing and its alignment with the respective drop in the price of TON Crystal has meant many are reluctant to dive too deeply into Free TON until there is a clear resolution and outcome to the respective votes. This does not mean we are dispassionate or unengaged. We have had several telegram channels with very active discussions on the topic, as well as our global chat and the 3 hour AMA session the other night. The recap posted above is merely the questions summarised by myself to get the main topics out of the way. Some of the answers many not be pretty, but that are honest, and above all we felt it was important that everybody understands the facts of the situation prior to voting.

Personally speaking, we’re proud of what we have done with the resources available to us and the climate, and feel this merger offers to bring great value to the Free TON table on many fronts. I would second Ron’s sentiment: